OGRE and OpenGL and Crystal Space, oh my!

[arcelios]

Hello,

I already have what I would consider an intermediate level of skill in C++. That is, I read Sam's Teach Yourself C++ in 24 Hours, and have a firm understanding of everything discussed there. I am now looking into game development, and I have decided to learn graphics programming first. After a few minutes of Wikipedia research, I learned of several graphics options, as well as the details of the French Revolution (interesting how that happens...). I came up with the following: OGRE 3D, OpenGL, SDL, Irrlicht, and Crystal Space. I understand that OGRE 3D, Irrlicht, and Crystal Space are higher-level graphics engines, and are theoretically more simple, but offer a lesser level of control. OpenGL and SDL are graphics libraries, which is far more lower-level, thus allowing (theoretically) more control over the graphics programming, but of course at the price of being more complicated.

Though I wholeheartedly enjoy programming and having control over what I create (not to mention having complete ownership of it), I would much prefer to spend time actually creating the game and its storyline than spend all my time writing boring code. However, if it means the game will be less mine, and less controllable, a higher-level graphics library might not be for me.

Of course, I don't expect whatever path I choose (hopefully based on your advice) to be "easy"-I expect to work on it, and spend many months just learning the basics of said libraries. However, I would hate to spend those months learning something I realize isn't actually what I was looking for, and have all that work go to waste.

It is, obviously, possible that I have missed an important library/engine here and feel free to correct me.

So, there you have it: the background. Just to clarify, here's my question: which of these libraries/engines would be the best combination of ease, control, and personal ownership?

Thanks in advance,
Arc

P.S. I would want a method that would allow me to create 2D games at first, as 3D games are, as I understand, quite a bit more difficult; both with graphics programming and the art department (2D sprites are easier to create than textured 3D models). Though, it would be nice to learn something that will eventually allow me to create 3D games with little additional learning.

[dandymcgee]

I would highly recommend SDL for 2d games and OpenGL for 3d games. I'm working on a project with SDL right now, and it definitely gives you control without being as difficult as it first seems. As far as OpenGL, that seems to be the standard for 3d (alongside Direct3D, microsoft's version). I haven't really gotten past drawing and moving basic primitives, so as far as ease and control I'm not really the one to talk to about OpenGL. I'm sure others will post with their opinions / experiences, and I wish you luck on finding the one right for you.

[arcelios]

I would highly recommend SDL for 2d games and OpenGL for 3d games. I'm working on a project with SDL right now, and it definitely gives you control without being as difficult as it first seems. As far as OpenGL, that seems to be the standard for 3d (alongside Direct3D, microsoft's version). I haven't really gotten past drawing and moving basic primitives, so as far as ease and control I'm not really the one to talk to about OpenGL. I'm sure others will post with their opinions / experiences, and I wish you luck on finding the one right for you.

What book/tutorial(s) did you use to learn SDL?

[andrew]

These are some that he's using: http://lazyfoo.net/SDL_tutorials/index.php


More tutorials and links here: http://elysianshadows.com/phpBB3/viewto ... art=999999

[arcelios]

Thanks for your replies,

As opposed to really deciding between OpenGL and SDL (though my interest is piqued by OpenGL), I would more ask for assistance deciding between OpenGL/SDL and OGRE 3D/Crystal Space/Irrlicht.

[dandymcgee]

The following is explanations are how I understand the topic at hand, and may be completely incorrect (this is the best I can do to explain it).

OpenGL/SDL:
These are libraries with predefined functions to that enable you to create graphics and render them to the screen.

OGRE 3D/Crystal Space/Irrlicht:
These are engines that you would build a graphics project on top of, whose functions handle the lower level stuff and help to prevent crashes and such.

And yes, for learning SDL I would most definitely recommend checking out the tutorials over at http://lazyfoo.net/SDL_tutorials/index.php For OpenGL http://nehe.gamedev.net/ would be the place to go.

[MarauderIIC]

I know this wasn't really your question, but between SDL and OpenGL, SDL is also a library that can handle more than just graphics, and 2D stuff is easier to do in SDL than OpenGL, although AFAIK SDL doesn't offer anything that really handles 3D. I think that SDL and OpenGL are usually used together, but graphics libraries are really my weak point. =)

Personally, if you don't need to really tweak things for performance, and your focus is to turn out a game (rather than have a big learning experience), I'd say that you should learn a higher-level solution (don't reinvent the wheel and all that). But I think you should also learn the basics of OpenGL just so you can tell if something's actually saving you effort :)

[trufun202]

I'm creating my game in Ogre3D. It's a really robust 3D engine, and I've found that it has WAY more bells & whistles than other frameworks, such as XNA. Plus, the Ogre3D forum is a great source for information.

I did some OpenGL 3D programming in college, which was fun, but way more bare-bones than what you'll find in the Ogre3D engine.

[dandymcgee]

Now I'll have to check out OGRE3d :P