Elysian Shadows

Okay...Most the population on these forums are atheists from what I can tell.

I'm much interested to know what morals are in your godless opinions. Do they exist? Are they user defined?

If so, tell me your morals. What do you consider 'wrong' and why? Are there consequences for 'wrong' actions? By whom? Tell me what you personally would and wouldn't do. And why.

I'm Christian.

Of course we have morals. Morals are just accepted standards of right and wrong. People see these standards, apply their experiences from life and generate their own morals.

What do I consider wrong? I find it difficult to list things from my mind. I can't even make a list of my favorite music. At all. So if you'd really like to know please ask me something specific and I'll tell you if I think it's right or wrong. About the only thing I can instantly skim off my brain when dealing with right and wrong is torture. I hate it with a maddening passion. If I were put in a situation where I could kill the torturer say by means of bullet to the head... I would. Is that "wrong"? I'm going to assume you would say yes because you claim to be Christian and as such should abide by a strict set of unquestionable unadaptable laws that accept no parameters (Thou shall not kill). I reason that is illogical.

EDIT:

Forgot to mention. I apparently have a very wrong sick twisted view on special ed kids (so I've been told by infuriated people [including my family]). Not just any special ed kids, the ones that lay slumped over in their wheel chairs drooling all day. The ones that cannot talk or move and must be fed through a feeding tube. The ones that are obviously mentally broken. I think it is horrible and cruel to keep them alive by unnatural means (they wouldn't be preservable 400 years ago). However, the mere suggestion of painlessly putting them down makes people think I'm an evil freak. Why is that?

JS Lemming wrote:I'm going to assume you would say yes because you claim to be Christian and as such should abide by a strict set of unquestionable unadaptable laws that accept no parameters (Thou shall not kill). I reason that is illogical.

*scratches head and seriously wonders what fucked up denomination you were*

That assumption right there is the exact reason that I hated you when you were Christian--Not for being Christian, but because of the dumb illogical ways that you went about it.

(so I've been told by infuriated people [including my family])

Lemme guess? Your family some kind of strict Catholics? I bet they didn't take it lightly when you declared infidelity? Or you didnt?

As for the retards--I fully agree. I've personally met a few like that...And I'd say that we've got no right to keep them alive by machine their whole life, especially when they can't make decisions of their own.

As for Morals...

What or the obvious ones? Rape? Murder?

Or what of Fornication?

Is lieing 'bad'? Are there sins?

Tell me what you think of drugs. Addictions. Sex-a-holics. Molesters.

Do you believe in Karma? Do you believe in fate? Are 'bad' people punished in the end?

All child molesters should be horribly disfigured. All rapists should be whipped to the point where their flesh is cut down to the bone in every spot imaginable. Those obviously guilty of cold-blooded murder should be killed so we don't have to pay for their upkeep. Abortion is okay if to destroy the product of rape. Or just because they don't want a baby. If it's in the woman, and not fully formed, I would consider it part of her and should be treated as such. If she wants it gone, then so be it. poop

Arce wrote:

JS Lemming wrote:I'm going to assume you would say yes because you claim to be Christian and as such should abide by a strict set of unquestionable unadaptable laws that accept no parameters (Thou shall not kill). I reason that is illogical.

*scratches head and seriously wonders what -KAZAAM!- up denomination you were*

That assumption right there is the exact reason that I hated you when you were Christian--Not for being Christian, but because of the dumb illogical ways that you went about it.

Exactly. But I could of sworn you were catholic. I know your mom was cause I saw her at church.

Arce wrote:

(so I've been told by infuriated people [including my family])

Lemme guess? Your family some kind of strict Catholics? I bet they didn't take it lightly when you declared infidelity? Or you didnt?

I have nuns as close relatives. It's pretty hardcore. I haven't told them and I don't plan too for some time. I just don't feel like dealing with it at the moment. No biggie.

Arce wrote:As for Morals...

What or the obvious ones? Rape? Murder?

Or what of Fornication?

Is lieing 'bad'? Are there sins?

Tell me what you think of drugs. Addictions. Sex-a-holics. Molesters.

Do you believe in Karma? Do you believe in fate? Are 'bad' people punished in the end?

Rape-wrong
Murder-wrong [if you think I'm contradicting myself it's because this is murder with no background information]
Fornication-people do it. If you are married it is cruel to your spouse. If unmarried it doesn't really hurt anyone does it
drugs-depends on which ones. If you do the ones that do you harm and/or cause addiction then you are just stupid. No good, no evil, just stupidity.
lying-depends on the situation. Most lying has negative effects on society so it's generally bad
sin-it's a word defined "an infraction against religious or moral law". It's not a physical thing it's an idea.
Molesters-causes people harm. bad.
Karma?-which definition are you referring to?
fate-....I don't know what you mean
bad people punished in the end?-you mean after they die? How can you be punished if you don't exist?


Simply put, if it causes someone pain or harm... it's bad. That's pretty much how my morals are.

Arce wrote:

JS Lemming wrote:I'm going to assume you would say yes because you claim to be Christian and as such should abide by a strict set of unquestionable unadaptable laws that accept no parameters (Thou shall not kill). I reason that is illogical.

*scratches head and seriously wonders what -KAZAAM!- up denomination you were*

That assumption right there is the exact reason that I hated you when you were Christian--Not for being Christian, but because of the dumb illogical ways that you went about it.

If you actually read the Bible and did what it said that's basically what you would be like. You are kind of a fucked up denomination. We've had this conversation before.

Karkash wrote:

Arce wrote:

JS Lemming wrote:I'm going to assume you would say yes because you claim to be Christian and as such should abide by a strict set of unquestionable unadaptable laws that accept no parameters (Thou shall not kill). I reason that is illogical.

*scratches head and seriously wonders what -KAZAAM!- up denomination you were*

That assumption right there is the exact reason that I hated you when you were Christian--Not for being Christian, but because of the dumb illogical ways that you went about it.

If you actually read the Bible and did what it said that's basically what you would be like. You are kind of a -KAZAAM!- up denomination. We've had this conversation before.

Basically, he hated you when you were Christian for being a Christian. Don't take it personally, he's a complete dipshit who thinks he can make anything up and call it Christianity.

It's pretty obvious, when you look at chimps and other great apes, that you don't need religion to have morals. Morality evolved it wasn't "intelligently" designed, this is clear because other monkeys also live by a set of moral standards. Morality also gives a species a survival advantage, if we didn't have it there wouldn't be much to stop us from killing each other nor would it have allowed civilizations to form.

So, how do we define these morals if there isn't a god around to fuck them up for us? Well, I find that pretty simple as well. The golden rule pretty much sums it up, do unto others as you would have them do unto you. If you're about to say hey wait that comes from the bible, then you need to do a little research the ancient greeks defined it way before any fictional biblical figure.

In conclusion, all you really need in order to have morals is empathy for the life around you and that doesn't require any god at all.

Rape-bad
Murder-depends
Fornication-only bad if you're cheating on someone
drugs-let people do what they want to their bodies, and making so many drugs illegal causes so much crime
lying-depends
sin-not real
Molesters-bad
Karma-fiction
fate-you can call any turn of events fate

I think you should do whatever you like as long as it isn't causing any legitamate pain. Abortion making someone sad doesn't count.



The only good thing that has come out of Chrisitanity is Jeanne D'Arc for PSP.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moral_relativity

Have fun with that mindfuck

Debate on moral relativism
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(tagged since June 2006)

:guffaw:

Most of you who replied didn't include prostitution. What of it?

Some dude did a persuasive speech in my class today for it. That had me cracking up, and wonder why I didn't do it. xD