Elysian Shadows

This moves me, all of these people are awesome. BUT, something no one seems to notice: the mom was a BITCH, first of all she caused ALL of this, she cause burns on 30% of her kid, burns on the firefighters arms, etc.

She was screaming at everyone to "Get her baby", where as she didn't even do anything to help.
Bitch.

http://www.phillyd.tv/2009/07/22/holy-fcking-hero/

jesus christ you are an asshole. its called an accident. get a fucking life.

Cool video. As for your opinion on the mother.. no comment.

Okay, look at it this way: this accident did not occur on a highway; it looks like a small residential street that wouldn't condone a speed above 25 MPH. This woman lost control of her car, hit a tree, causing the car to flip onto its side and burst into flames. Do you have any idea how fucking fast you need to be going for that to even have a chance of happening? It's also worth noting that the car doesn't appear to be very close to any of the trees around, so it presumably kept rolling or sliding on its side after it struck the tree. This had to have fallen under reckless driving, with children in the car no less, so I'm not about to start defending the mother.

However, she was one of the few I could understand shouting, as it was most traumatic for those in the car, and they were her children. Most of the other people were just shouting at people to do what they were already doing, or repeating things like "Come on!" - that is the least useful activity I could imagine in that situation, and only served to add noise to obscure the useful people's shouts for others to get a hose, knife, etc.

More importantly, however, it did show those great people who put themselves at risk to save lives, and that's what makes it so notable. And it's what we should really focus on - I simply hate knee-jerk reactions of defending someone because they were in an undesirable position. She caused that accident, and in such an overly-extravagant manner that she is far from the innocent in this scenario. Sympathy shouldn't excuse anyone from being called on their shit. If I slammed into a tree, rolled a car over, slid it down the road so that it caught fire in my neighborhood, I would expect nothing less than "What the fuck were you doing?"

Also, PhillyD is awesome.

Didn't help? Have you ever stepping into a flaming car? Actually, ever get close to a campfire? It's fucking hot! There were two professional firefighters on the scene and many people helping them. If the mother tried to interfere she might have made things worse.

aamesxdavid wrote: I simply hate knee-jerk reactions of defending someone because they were in an undesirable position. She caused that accident, and in such an overly-extravagant manner that she is far from the innocent in this scenario. Sympathy shouldn't excuse anyone from being called on their shit.

It's called an accident for a reason.. even if it was her fault it quite obviously wasn't one of her goals for the day. Regardless of the situation, I highly doubt she deserves being called a "BITCH".

dandymcgee wrote:It's called an accident for a reason.. even if it was her fault it quite obviously wasn't one of her goals for the day. Regardless of the situation, I highly doubt she deserves being called a "BITCH".

I'm not condoning calling anyone a bitch, particularly for freaking out in the situation she was in, the same way I'm not going to condone automatically attacking someone for having a low opinion of someone who got themselves into that situation. This was an accident in the same way that firing a gun randomly and it happening to kill someone is. Intentions are meaningless when the combination of your carelessness and stupidity hurt someone. Of course she didn't mean to lose control of the car, but she was obviously being careless while she did have control of it, which is what made the accident what it was. It's highly unlikely she would have lost control of the car at all had she been doing the speed limit. And even if she still did lose control of the car, it certainly never would have flipped and burst into flames.

I don't call her a bitch for not interfering with what the firefighters were doing; I call her an idiot for the completely irresponsible speed she must have been going to create such a scenario, combined with her inability to handle the vehicle at that speed. Calling something an accident doesn't excuse the person involved when it could have been easily avoided by that person doing what they were supposed to be doing.

aamesxdavid wrote:

dandymcgee wrote:It's called an accident for a reason.. even if it was her fault it quite obviously wasn't one of her goals for the day. Regardless of the situation, I highly doubt she deserves being called a "BITCH".

I'm not condoning calling anyone a bitch, particularly for freaking out in the situation she was in, the same way I'm not going to condone automatically attacking someone for having a low opinion of someone who got themselves into that situation.

*Edited Out*

Not trying to spark anymore conflict over this video, because we both know our opinions of the mother's actions are irrelevant to the reason the video was posted in the first place. I was just trying to understand your point of view correctly.

aamesxdavid i though i am one opinionated asshole but you are just a straight up fuck face.

- a car that rolls can catch on fire very easily. as you can note the fire is at the back. guess what. the gas tank is in the back... the gas tank more than
likely tore when the car rolled and the gas caught fire on the exhaust system.
- that car weights a lot. now there is something called inertia...(this might get hard for you but just bare with) things that are heavy tend not to wanna stop... if you look at the car it looked like she cliped the tree on the right front/side. probably causing the roll. but probably did not stop the car much. that car could have slid 20 yards. the friction coef between tar and metal is quite low. she could have been going 30 mph and that could have happened.oh and not to mention that that car's CoG is uber high. making it really easy to roll over.

it was a mom, not a drunk 18 old kid with his gf that he is trying to impress. for all you know the kids could have been distracting her. choking what ever. but you mr high and mighty seem all to quick to judge others actions just like shit shoes who started the thread.

jesus christ you are an asshole. its called an accident. get a fucking life.

My opinion on the mom was a joke. I was expecting comments like this and then being sent to the "posts you shouldn't make" section, not a huge discussion.

avansc wrote:you are just a straight up fuck face.

And here I didn't think we agreed on anything. Let's see if there isn't anything else we can agree on.

Like the fact that I just can't keep up with your science/math here. Because common sense would tell me that if a car hits a tree while heading straight for it, even if it only hit a corner, it would significantly slow down that car. If it came at an angle, the car must have been sliding before it hit the tree - assuming that the coefficient of friction between rubber and tar is greater than that between tar and metal (which you must tell me, as I am clearly inept), this would have slowed down the car even more than it sliding on its side. If it had been traveling at a mere 30MPH (at which speed it is also not very common to completely lose control of a car, barring some other force interfering), either of these things would have presumably slowed the car to the point that it could not slide very far once on its side. And as you were so keen to note the damage on the car, it certainly points to the latter of these two scenarios, which would have slowed the car even before impact with the tree, making it even less likely to roll once it hit. But as you say, I shouldn't meddle in these subjects in which I have already proven my inferiority. After all, neither of us were there, so let's find out from the people who were.

The only published statement the police made as to how this accident could have occurred is that the woman "may have fallen asleep before slamming into a tree"(*). If the cops arrive at the scene, and their best guess as to how your accident happened is that you were unconscious, you must have done something very wrong. Okay, so maybe she came down with a sudden case of narcolepsy, and maybe one of her children swung an exceptionally heavy toy and knocked her out. There are all sorts of excuses one could make, and with no information, you're just coming up with scenarios to give that person the benefit of the doubt.

And this is the reason I bothered responding at all. After all, if I took it upon myself to argue with everyone who had an opinion different from mine, particularly after quickly drawing such an accurate description of my character from a single thread (even one that so perfectly exemplifies this character), I'd have carpal tunnel long before I got through them all. The reason I find this response so amusing is that it is the very antithesis to how you approach everyone on these forums. Everyone here is a mere irritation to the god-like intellect and reason of avansc. But a woman who smashes her car into a tree in a residential zone is automatically innocent of any wrongdoing, and deserving of your valiant defending. I find that pretty hilarious.

*http://wcbstv.com/topstories/burning.ca ... 93184.html

And this is the very reason I chose not to bother arguing over what caused the crash and who was at fault. I wasn't about to lose whatever small amount of respect I have by defending or prosecuting a case that I have absolutely no facts on, only hypotheses.

Let us kindly agree that nobody will ever know exactly what happened before the crash, but what happened after was astonishing. These guys put themselves in the line of fire (no pun intended) for someone they didn't even know because they knew that no matter how it happened neither the mother nor the children deserved being burned to death inside a heap of twisted metal that was once the family vehicle.

Pickzell wrote: My opinion on the mom was a joke. I was expecting comments like this and then being sent to the "posts you shouldn't make" section, not a huge discussion.

If you believe your sole purpose on these forums is to say things you don't really mean in order to spark flame wars, please do us all a favor and go back to wherever it is you came from.

Pickzell wrote: My opinion on the mom was a joke. I was expecting comments like this and then being sent to the "posts you shouldn't make" section, not a huge discussion.

If you believe your sole purpose on these forums is to say things you don't really mean in order to spark flame wars, please do us all a favor and go back to wherever it is you came from.

You kind of contradict what I said.

not a huge discussion.

I posted this video saying "These people are awesome" because they did something heroic that most people wouldn't do in the first place. People took the meaning of my post as my incredibly low opinion on the mom, which is still quite negative, rather than looking at what the people did in the video. You yourselves started a flame war.

I strongly agree with aamesxdavid's posts because he was the one person who put a convincing argument rather than "Fuck you fucking fuckface fucker fuck."

In any case, there really was a bitch here, that bitch being CNN, obviously the camera guy does deserve some credit, but no one else gets any, not the fire fighters, lady with the hose, etc. That's the media I guess :/

Pickzell wrote:

If you believe your sole purpose on these forums is to say things you don't really mean in order to spark flame wars, please do us all a favor and go back to wherever it is you came from.

You kind of contradict what I said.

not a huge discussion.

I posted this video saying "These people are awesome" because they did something heroic that most people wouldn't do in the first place. People took the meaning of my post as my incredibly low opinion on the mom, which is still quite negative, rather than looking at what the people did in the video. You yourselves started a flame war.

What I meant by that was if you're expecting a post you're about to make to be moved into the "Posts You Shouldn't Make" then maybe you should reconsider how you're posting.

Pickzell wrote: In any case, there really was a bitch here, that bitch being CNN, obviously the camera guy does deserve some credit, but no one else gets any, not the fire fighters, lady with the hose, etc. That's the media I guess :/

I also agree they should have gotten the guys' names, but the only reason they put the camera guy's name on it at all was for legal purposes. He does in fact own the video.

sorry for my post. was a heated day. anyways. i just dont think blaming this woman is right. i didnt say defend her. but certainly dont say she was reckless. we just dont know.
she might just be a bad driver. there are a million things that could have caused this..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z_fEMHQx ... r_embedded

see.. you can roll a car at 5 mph... lol

anyways. sorry again. i have days of tourette's .