Ok, so this is the part when I embarrass myself online...

[Arnavoni]

Ok, so I'm having some problems at university. I imagine the people here will have something valuable to say, as many of you have finished school or are still in it.

I've only been at my university for a couple of semesters now, so I do wonder if my judgements are premature, but I've grown really frustrated with its CS and SWE programs here. Every CS/SWE class I have taken has been 99% insubstantial, useless busywork thus far, and practically no material has been covered in any of them.

I'm currently taking Data Structures, for example. The professor spent the first half of the semester reviewing the basics of C++ and rambling about assorted bullshit for three hours each week ( herp derp xkcd and my kids lulz ). Now, the semester is almost over and he's barely TOUCHED any actual data structures material (woo, a stupid, wasteful assignment to store a STRING as a linked list and make it into goddamned PIG LATIN =\ ). He's planning to spend, oh, a week or so on trees right before Winter break. The FUCK is this shit? Is it like this everywhere? >_<

Also, looking through the course catalogue and talking to professors and other students hasn't given me a positive outlook about the rest of the classes I'll be in. It seems like more of the same BS, across the board. No hardware classes, no GOOD classes otherwise that I can dig up.

I guess my problem is this: I'm working my ass off because I took too many courses for myself to keep up with, I feel like throwing up most mornings from worrying about my grades, and I feel like all the effort is a waste of time because none of my important classes are teaching me anything. The most I've learned I've learned with coffee, books, and the Internet. My question for you all is "What the fuck do I do about it?" The only advice I can seem to find elsewhere is the typical "Oh, yeah, well what's impoetant is datchoo get dat peeca papah" and I hate that attitude. I want to learn something, and so far this college has taken a lot of money and time without providing anything useful but a library.

[TheBuzzSaw]

OK, chill out dude. After filtering out much of your blabbering anger, frankly, I don't see much wrong with anything. Yes, they have to teach basics because the classes revolve around the lowest common denominator: someone who has never touched programming in his life. So, are you saying you already knew all about data structures? Good for you! If you want that degree, just suffer through it anyway. You have to fulfill all the requirements to reach the end. Keep in mind that generally speaking programming is very difficult. I have seen plenty of students claim that such classes go too fast.

When I started my degree, I already knew C++. So, my intro class was essentially a waste of time. However, each subsequent class revealed small holes in my knowledge. By the time I reached my junior/senior level classes, I realized how little I truly knew about CS, and I was a completely different engineer by the end. Be patient. Don't flaunt your arrogance and mock the teacher. That'll land you in trouble.

[qpHalcy0n]

I have to disagree. I see two problems here. One of which is understandable, the other not so much.

First, in a Data Structures/Algo class, they should NOT be teaching language specifics in any way, shape, form, or fashion. You should know Java, C, C++ or whatever. College isn't high school, you can not teach to the lowest common denominator. If your college does, then you need to leave under the assumption that they have a very poor program. As a computer engineer, Data Structures, Discrete Structures, and Digital Logic are among the paramount in foundation courses. They should be *excruciatingly* difficult because the subject matter is...well, difficult and everything you do after these courses will rely heavily on what you did in these three courses. I remember taking data structures/algorithms and the first week was formal mathematical proofs of function efficiency and space. It was incredibly detailed, very technical, and extremely difficult. Over half of the class dropped after test 1. We have a very good engineering department and it's just expected of you that you buck up and force yourself up to that level....not teach down to "the lowest common denominator". That is absolutely absurd....I would NEVER pay what I pay to go to school for a highly qualified professor to talk to me like i'm an idiot. Besides, you don't go to school for "programming". "Programming" is a shitty title and NOT something you should aspire to. I definitely sympathize with you on that. So, justified there.

Secondly, college should be brutal. It really should transform bad habits into good ones and make a good thinker out of ya. This entails putting your life in the passenger seat and doing what is expected of you. That is alot of freakin work. So, not justified there. You will work your ass off, so don't bitch about working hard. It's part of the deal.

Where do you attend school, if you don't mind me asking?

[TheBuzzSaw]

I think you took my statement a bit to the extreme. I am not implying that the class should slow down, make adjustments, etc. for whoever is doing the worst in the class. I am only saying that the class has to operate on the assumption that it is your first-time exposure to the concept. It's OK for the class to move fast and cover the basics very quickly. I'm just saying that the class cannot jump straight to "well you should know how stacks work because, well, this is CS and that's just common knowledge".

Heck, every class in every department has to operate this way!

And I agree that the class should be concept-focused, not language-focused.

[Arnavoni]

Firstly, I'm not arrogant. I'm pissed because I want to be learning from my classes. From the perspective of the "lowest common denominator" these classes would still be useless. That's my point. That's why I'm angry, not because I think my professor is an idiot or because I fancy myself "better" than the other students. The class is inadequate to all of its students, not just me. If the book by itself is better than the course at teaching me, something is wrong and college is a repeat of high school.

Also, I didn't mean to convey that I hate hard work. I don't. I love hard work and if I didn't I wouldn't be an aspiring programmer. I was bitching because I'm working hard but not getting much out of it. The work is "hard" because it can be tedious and time-consuming, but it is mostly busywork. And the bitching about my work load wasn't about my CS classes. Granted, the work from them has wasted my time, but most of my workload is from elsewhere (and the CS classes simply aren't helping, but adding to the problem of work that is doing little to no good).

To me, classes labeled "intro to X" should be introductory classes, but every class after them should actually have some substance to it. =( Data Structures should not be a class "about the basics" and it certainly shouldn't be a class about how ints and inheritance work in C++.

I'm currently attending UVA-Wise.

I apologize for my "blabbering anger" as you put it, and yeah, I could have been more concise and less ranty about my post. Sorry. =\ And sorry that this post is extremely unorganized. This is maybe the... 12th post I've made on any forums ( I tend to be a lurker ).

[TheBuzzSaw]

If your professor is taking that long to get to an real worthwhile content, then yeah, you have a right to be upset. I just know that I was a bit too arrogant at the beginning because of my previous knowledge.

[LeonBlade]

Firstly, I'm not arrogant. I'm pissed because I want to be learning from my classes. From the perspective of the "lowest common denominator" these classes would still be useless. That's my point. That's why I'm angry, not because I think my professor is an idiot or because I fancy myself "better" than the other students. The class is inadequate to all of its students, not just me. If the book by itself is better than the course at teaching me, something is wrong and college is a repeat of high school.

Also, I didn't mean to convey that I hate hard work. I don't. I love hard work and if I didn't I wouldn't be an aspiring programmer. I was bitching because I'm working hard but not getting much out of it. The work is "hard" because it can be tedious and time-consuming, but it is mostly busywork. And the bitching about my work load wasn't about my CS classes. Granted, the work from them has wasted my time, but most of my workload is from elsewhere (and the CS classes simply aren't helping, but adding to the problem of work that is doing little to no good).

To me, classes labeled "intro to X" should be introductory classes, but every class after them should actually have some substance to it. =( Data Structures should not be a class "about the basics" and it certainly shouldn't be a class about how ints and inheritance work in C++.

I'm currently attending UVA-Wise.

I apologize for my "blabbering anger" as you put it, and yeah, I could have been more concise and less ranty about my post. Sorry. =\ And sorry that this post is extremely unorganized. This is maybe the... 12th post I've made on any forums ( I tend to be a lurker ).

I was going to go to college a few years ago, but I decided not to. Mainly for these reasons that I felt I would run into, among others of course. The "Golden Ticket" that piece of paper you are referring to isn't enough to make me want to spend loads of money on formal education when I can learn the same information myself.
I don't know what you should do, I've never been in the situation, but I definitely can see your pain here.